why not use lever action rifle by army/police etc?

Question

Can any one tell me why Idiotic bolt action rifles are ruling when the old west lever action rifles were much faster and had larger (under the barrel) magazine,......The lever action could be shot with just a sway of the palm to reload where as the bolt action needs the right hand to leave the trigger pull the bolt and so on are the weapon controllers of governments nuts or am I a dumb?

Answer 1

There have been some law-enforcement agencies which have used lever-action rifles, mostly in rural areas of the US and Canada.



Most lever-action rifles have the tubular magazines, which are slow to reload. Rifles such as the Savage 99 and Browning BLR have detachable magazines, which could speed reloading and permit use of the pointed bullets. But they're too susceptible to having dirt jam them up.



And yeah, the pinpoint accuracy depicted in the movies is frequently just a figment of someone's imagination.

Answer 2

The real world is not Hollywood.



Imagine you are pinned down behind a very small log - not standing up tall on a horse like in the movies - you have no room to swing a big old lever.



Lever action rifles are required to use blunt, flat nose bullets or it will set off the primer of the cartridge in front of it! You ever stick your hand out a car window at 45+mph and notice how a finger goes nice though the air, but, you flat hand gets pushed back? Bullets that work in a lever acton rifle fly terrible through the air - they loose allot of speed and power on the way to a target, and, because of the flat nose have terrible penetration. Worse - you send a bullet from a lever action into the rear quarters of deer - you loose allot of meat that a regular bullet would not mess up.



Lever actions, because they are built on a 'falling block' design - cannot handle the power an 'idiotic' bolt acton rifle or a semi-auto with a lockup bolt can. You don't see any lever action rifles for sale that take belted magnum cases......... because lever actons are for low power cartridges.



Between the poor bullet charastics required to safely use in a lever acton, the low power when compaired to other rifles........ and how quckly the bullet looses speed - the accuracy of a level action basically sucks out loud.



You are not dumb. Your are just inexperienced. Someday you will be somewhere and then see a movie about it, or, read a paper about the incident - and you will be shocked at how what you witnessed is nothing like what you saw or read in the paper! When you then consider that every movie and every newspaper, magazine, and cable news channel has the same issue - you will have some serious soul searching about what you think is right, and what is really the truth.



Me. I once saw a boat on fire and the captain was the first one off with no consideration for the crew or passangers. Eyes like pie plates scared like a deer in the headlights. Next month he is receiving an award for heroism - saving his passengers and crew.

Answer 3

Because with very few exceptions, a bolt action rifle is more accurate than the lever action rifles, especially at long range.



"Okay but do you mean to say the old west did not have pinpoint accuracy?the films we see are all cinema fantasies?" - You mean you don't know that all movies are fantasies? Do you actually believe that film makers spent hours and days researching history and then depict very scene down to the last detail accurately? Man, are you in for a rude awakening. I have never seen a single western movie accurately depicted.



A lever action rifles in the old west used tubular magazines. That means the rounds are held so that the tip of one bullet is in contact with the primer of the round in front. Because of this the bullet cannot have a pointed tip since it may accidentally cause the round in front to fire causing a chain explosion in the magazine tube. It has been known to happen even with flat nose bullets. It is only in the last 10 years that a safe pointed tip bullet could be used in a tubular magazine - see Leverevolution ammos. That means accurate long range shooting were not possible because the Spitzer bullet that is now the standard shape of all modern rifle bullets could not be used. The Spitzer is a more aerodynamically streamline shape, unlike the bullets used in the Old West.



Tubular magazines are also more prone to damage because they are typically made as light as possible and to make them stronger meant adding more weight to the rifle, particularly to the front making such a rifle top heavy and very unwieldy to handle.



Lever action also are more prone to jamming. They are also not as sturdy in terms of bolt lockup which is one factor that contributes or detract from accuracy. It is also easier to maintain a bolt action in the field than a lever action - ever field strip a lever action rifle?



You may think lever action rifles are faster than bolt action, but that is from the movies. Have you ever try to use a lever action rifle when you are on the ground in the prone position? You can't actuate the lever unless you turn the rifle on it's side. With a bolt action, you don't and if you train properly, you won't even need to take your sight off the target when cycling the bolt.

Answer 4

Until very recently - and at considerably greater expense - the standard bolt action rifle was the most accurate rifle on the battlefield. It costs many thousands of dollars more to produce a similarly accurate semiautomatic long arm; and, even with all that extra money, the bolt action would still be the more reliable weapon of the two. Snow, ice, sand, and mud have a much harder time stopping an ordinary bolt action than anybody's high-tech semiautomatic design.



As for police using a lever action carbine? Yes, that would work and work well. Soldiers? No! Soldiers often need to suppress larger numbers of other soldiers as well as heavy automatic fire. A lever action wouldn't work as well as an M-4 on a modern battlefield.



(A good man with either a bolt or a lever action long arm is, I believe, a lot faster than you imagine. Watch a cowboy action contest sometime. I think you'll be surprised.)

Answer 5

Not dumb, just not knowledgable. Back in the day, the Army believed that it was more appropriate to conserve ammunition, so the trapdoor springfield was the issue weapon. The attitude continued through WWI and into the early days of WWII, until the advantages of a semi-auto over a bolt-action was made apparant by the M1 Garand.



You would think that what the Army learned about the lever-action in the Spanish-American War would have swayed the decision.



Finally, up until very recently only flat-nosed bullets could be used in tubular magazines. Flat-nosed bullets are less accurate at distance compared to spitzer style bullets and influenced the decision away from lever-actions.



From the bolt-action point of view, it is the most accurate style of rifle made.

Answer 6

It's really already been covered, but there are several reasons. They are less powerful, less accurate, lower ballistic coefficient due to the tubular magazine necessitating blunt tips, etc. Bolt Action rifles are used when pinpoint accuracy, higher velocity, and a larger bore are needed. When speed is needed, semi-automatic rifles, automatic rifles, or sub-machine guns are typically used. Additionally, with practice, the bolt can be cycled very quickly and efficiently, and the trigger finger needs to leave the trigger on a lever action as well.



That being said, I love my Marlin 336 as well as my Remington 700. :D

Answer 7

Actually the US Army did have trials for the use of Winchester military lever actions in the 1890's. American Rifle had a story on this a few years back. In trial use in the Phillipine Insurection, The Winchester 1895 were found less than perfect for combat. Hard to clean, hard to fire prone, and some other issues. The Biggest reason earlier lever guns were rejected, was Ammo power. The guns were not chambered for the standard .45-70 round used in the Trapdoor Springfield. Even the Buffalo hunters used high power Sharps & Remington Rolling Blocks. Not 1873's in 44-40. Turkey did however have success using lever guns. Winchesters stopped for almost half a year the reapeated major assaults of the combined Russo-Roumanian Armies at the Battle of Plevna (1877). This was the first major military engagement in which the use of repeating firearms had a substantial influence on it's battles and in which extraordinarily heavy casualties were repeatedly inflicted. The Turks engaged the charging Russians at long range with their M1872 Peabody-Martini rifles (long range, powerful and flat trajectory for its day). The Russians were armed with the already obsolete Krnka rifles and only a limited number of Berdan I and Berdan II rifles. When the Russians closed to within 200 yeards, the Turks switched arms and engaged them with the repeating Winchesters and cut them to ribbons.



"The Plevna Delay" : An EXCELLENT exposition of the engagements at Plevna is told by Richard T. Trenk, Sr., in an article appearing in Man At Arms Magazine, Volume 19, Number Four, August, 1997, entitled "The Plevna Delay" which is reproduced here in part. An excellent as well as exciting story and I strongly recommend you take the time to read and enjoy it!!

Answer 8

The bolt action rifle is much stronger and can handle higher pressures.



A bolt action is much faster to reload with the use of stripper clips.



A lever action cannot be easily operated in the prone position, where much fighting is done.



A bolt action has a much stronger extraction force due to the camming action.



Spitzer bullets are a problem in tubular magazines.



Bolt action rifles tend to be more accurate.



In the Spanish American War, Spain used bolt-action Model 1893 7mm Mauser rifles. These rifles used twin front locking lugs, which is very strong. They used stripper clips for reloading. It was a much better rifle than the U. S. 1892 30-40 Krag.

Answer 9

The question never got here up in uk, Europe or Africa. interior the U. S., lever movements have been greater common at one time, while pictures have been short and massive ability develop into no longer needed. After WW I, the '03 Springfield became known, and its ability and accuracy have been pronounced out west, the place long pictures at greater animals have been to be got here across. As a deer searching rifle, the Savage ninety 9, Winchester 88 and Browning BLR are nonetheless extremely sturdy for almost anybody, yet those with greater classic lines and tubular magazines are short-to-reasonable variety propositions in an afternoon while greater long pictures are taken, and a large variety of want a rifle which could do for elk and moose as nicely as deer, and a large variety of of the lever movements at the instant are not sturdy sufficient to handle the greater efficient cartridges. And at present maximum individuals grew up with bolt weapons, so the lever action is headed for subject to nostalgic use in basic terms. value of hearth is inconsequential to hunters.

Answer 10

lever actions can't use spitzer bullets that are so prevalent in highly accurate calibers. The bolt action is stronger than a lever action. Bolt actions handle better on a rest or bag. The lock time is faster in a bolt action.

Answer 11

Law enforcement agencies in the past have used quite a few lever guns.

They've never been a good pick for the military, because much of their shooting is from the prone. The lever has the ground in the way. And there was a time when military higher-ups preferred lower firepower to encourage marksmanship over spray-and-pray.

Answer 12

Reloading.



A lever action is far harder and more time consuming to reload.



A bolt action, depending on the gun of course, can be loaded with a detachable magazine, or clip to feed an internal magazine.

Answer 13

If you need a sniper kill, then bolt action are way more accurate

If you need a lot of shots fast, then you need semi/fully auto so you don't have to try to load a tubular magazine while under fire, and wouldn't it be easier to just pull a trigger then trying to pull a lever after every shot?

Answer 14

The military had another issue: they considered the tubular magazine to be prone to damage. This would render the weapon a single shot.

Answer 15

If you want pin point accuracy the bolt action is the choice, and that is what police want the less bullets fired the less chance an on looker could be hit. They want a one shot, case closed deal; and so does the public. As for the second part of your question; I leave that for you to answer yourself!